tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13195130.post111798170708055794..comments2023-10-20T09:37:46.092-04:00Comments on The Philosophical Midwife: Freedom and EvilDr. Mhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00209597695197799059noreply@blogger.comBlogger3125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13195130.post-1118623952670164022005-06-12T19:52:00.000-05:002005-06-12T19:52:00.000-05:00I think you're closer than you think here. There i...I think you're closer than you think here. There is genuine freedom without fear of a second fall. <BR/><BR/>Today our freedom consists of the ability to choose good or evil (the tree Adam and Eve ate from was "the knowledge of good and evil"). For those who choose life, who choose to follow God, he will give them what they have freely asked, which is righteousness. This will be in the future state ("heaven"). <BR/><BR/>Then, yes, some of our "freedom" will no longer remain; the option to sin will no longer be there. But this is not a loss of freedom; it is the fulfillment of a free choice. And there will be plenty of freedom within the realm of righteous choices then, as is the case also now.<BR/><BR/>Freedom and righteousness are thus both preserved.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13195130.post-1118584578382180932005-06-12T08:56:00.000-05:002005-06-12T08:56:00.000-05:00I certainly do feel the tug of the view that the b...I certainly do feel the tug of the view that the best, the highest kind of love is a love that is freely bewtowed.<BR/><BR/>But what do we mean by freedom here? Some take genuine freedom to imply that we could have done otherwise than we did. If this is right, then it seems that, so long as I am free, a very real possibility exists that I will sin yet again. This will hold even after God has healed the breach of the Fall and raised us to the perfection that pre-Fall man possessed.<BR/><BR/>But this seems to imply that the Fall could happen again. I resist this conclusion.<BR/><BR/>So it seems to me that genuine freedom does not imply the ability to have done otherwise. I don't want to be able to not love my wife and children. I don't want to be able to not love God. Rather, what I want is this: a perfected nature and a perfect communion with God and neighbor that will quite inevitably lead me to love as I ought. <BR/><BR/>I know that it sounds a bit strange to inject talk of what I want here. But I believe that where there is a genuine desire or need, there exists that which will fulfill it. I believe that desire as it were points to higher truths.Dr. Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00209597695197799059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13195130.post-1118539426475414122005-06-11T20:23:00.000-05:002005-06-11T20:23:00.000-05:00Franklin, these are the right questions.Freedom mu...Franklin, these are the right questions.<BR/><BR/>Freedom must be real, or everything is meaningless. That preserves the theodicy, as you pointed out here.<BR/><BR/>I commented <A HREF="http://philosophicalmidwifery.blogspot.com/2005/05/why-be-free.html" REL="nofollow">earlier</A> that whether we "should wish to be free" or not is moot. We simply are.<BR/><BR/>God created us in His image, which has to do with intellect, emotion, will, and freedom of will. This is all within the limits of creatures who are by no means God. We were created in a state "far short of perfect" if perfection is measured by God's omniscience, omnipotence, and other transcendent qualities. Mankind was, however, once perfect in moral qualities; nothing separated him morally from God before the fall. <BR/><BR/>Will God someday bring us to perfection? There are those who have submitted freely to God, and as it says in I John, <A HREF="http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=69&chapter=3&verse=2&version=50&context=verse" REL="nofollow">'we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is.</A> This is a return to moral perfection; it is the fulfillment of God's promise to those who <A HREF="http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%205:6;&version=50;" REL="nofollow">'hunger and thirst after righteousness.</A> <BR/><BR/>Others will find that their freedom has brought them, by their choice, to be separated from God forever (this is what hell is about).<BR/><BR/>So freedom is not a sign of immaturity. It is a sign of being in God's image, and ultimately we will receive the results of our free choices.<BR/><BR/>Still...<BR/><BR/>I'm certainly hoping I'm on track with the kinds of things you're working through. Sometimes, even in <A HREF="http://www.thinkingchristian.net/" REL="nofollow">my own blog</A> and the conversations that flow from it, I really wish I could carry out these dialogues face to face. I'm more confident that what I've written here is true, than I am confident that it really meets the question that was raised...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com